Every once in a while I must venture into wingnut world just to keep a grip on the world at large. It's a scary enterprise which I rarely have the stomach for anymore.
It seems one of the latest rages on the right is the Solyndra debacle. I must admit that I have only some knowledge of the story but I think I have enough to make a few points. First is it a shady deal. I don't know but I'll say should it be its something that shouldn't be happening. It surely went wrong and turned out to be a bad investment. I have no issue with that point. What I have an issue with is the undertone that says this is a repudiation of alternative energy and pushing it as a society through our government.
There is a long, probably boring, argument that I could make in favor of the government assisting in advancing society at a rate that exceeds corporate confidence. That businesses often fail and that is a slight on private enterprise as much as it is the government. I would rather make another point though.
I think many people aren't aware that giant corporations are fined for government fraud all the time and STILL have government contracts. You'd think intentionally cheating the government out of its money would be a bad thing but most say nothing. Nope but Solyndra is worth weeks of coverage.
Actual, confirmed corporate fraud is happening on a regular basis. Even just with the ones who are getting caught. Here is the latest one.
Oracle will pay the General Services
Administration (GSA) more than $199.5 million to settle a lawsuit that
accused the vendor of overcharging the federal government for software
and services......Paul Frascella filed suit against the company
in 2007 claiming that Oracle was not providing the government discounts
that were as low as some other customers were receiving, even though the
company said it was.
"Because of these allegedly fraudulent dealings, the United States
alleges that it accepted lower discounts and ultimately paid far more
than it should have for Oracle products," according to the DOJ.
Thats right they were suppose to give their big customer, the government, best price. But hey, its the government. You know how it goes. Everybody is for cutting government spending as long as it isn't theirs.
Yes Solyndra as a company was a mistake and a failure. To use Solyndra as any kind of club against free/alternative energy is making it obvious that you have no interest in changing the status quo.
Don't think the rest of the world is going to wait for us to catch up.
What is so objectionable about a big push to start making individuals self sustainable? That is the goal. Here's an argument that may have universal appeal.
Our enemies can't take down the power grid. If each home is equipped with their own free/alternative energy system it would be impossible to disable the country at anything near the rate it could be done now.
Unfortunately bubba seems to think it impossible to push forward and all that modern technology is jus dreamin',apparently content and anxious for his 5 dollar gas. "Hey you socialist pinko you're destroying my freedom for 5 dollar gas, I want my damn five dollar gas, shut up!"
Like I said, it's stomach churning.
11 comments:
Oracle settled to avoid more costly litigation. No verdict of guilt has been given by any court. How typical of you to use this as an example of wrongdoing when none has been proven. It's enough for you that a large company was taken to court, therefor it MUST be guilty. Talk about stomach churning.
Look. If you want to imagine that all large corporations are running the world, have at it. If you're going to wear the tinfoil hat, you need a good spiel to go with it. But if you're going to name anyone specific, you need proof. Here, nothing was "confirmed" simply because one guy made an accusation, and even you ought to feel some shame for stooping so low as to play this game. Are they guilty of the charges? We may never know. But sorry sad sacks like you apparently don't need anything more than an accusation to provide guilt. Nice.
Solyndra isn't the only alternative energy company going nowhere. The gripe is the federal tax dollars going to a company already showing signs of collapse. At the very least, the feds need to wait until there is private money being invested before it offers anything, if it should offer anything at all. Private investors investigate and vet the company before throwing in a dime because it needs to make a profit. Only idiots, like this administration, donates to a lost cause or to a cause without knowing everything about it. THAT'S where the gripe is.
And what enemies are you talking about? Are you sewing xenophobia, fear and division? If our defense contractors invent a way to equip individual structures that can then be massed produced on the open market, then that is acceptable. Throwing money just to subsidize an unproven idea is wasteful, especially when there are plentiful proven resources at our fingertips that can lead to a healthier economy. Try using your head.
At the hearings today, the implication was that DOE did not perform good due diligence. That was a totally erroneous assumption. This has nothing to do with good or bad due diligence. What this is about is that in a 2008 meeting: Lachlan Seward, Matt Rogers & Steve Spinner pointed to a piece of paper and, essentially, said: "these are our friends, they will get money. These are their competitors and our lobbyists competitors, they will not get money." All so-called due-diligence thereafter was purposely non-existant or steered towards those friends and against those competitors. I was there!
And you would be so forgiving and understanding if this had been Bush's debacle.
OK Art here is the deal. I have found that there is nothing I can say or do, no link I can provide, no rational explanation that I can offer that will satisfy a wingnut. I've experimented with this for a decade now at least. Its a waste of time. And my experiences with you over the years are among those that convinced me of that.
Hell Dave and Norma obviously didn't even bother to read my post before they started spouting their wingnuttia pre programmed talking points. I gave no forgiveness or understanding or defense of the deal. They seemed to miss that in their hurry to pound a liberal. At least you modified yours to what I actually said. You are getting no argument from me for the world you live in and your goals and aspirations for it are far different from mine, hence not relevant for me.
Ok Art that might have seemed a little harsh. I've thought about this and maybe you will understand this.
We view the world and what is of value and what is not quite differently. You have no love of the world I dream of and I have revulsion of the world you dream of.
We have fundamentally different goals and dreams. There is no agreement there...anywhere. It's pointless to debate when the outcome is assured.
I have my own perspective on love compassion and empathy, on greed hate and division and I am going to follow my heart in those endeavors and not someone elses mind. I dont want a social darwin, trickle down, profit is God world. So hate me for it but debating me on it is fruitless. It is also fruitless for me to try to convince you. Which is why I don't waste my time on it.
I would suggest you do something more useful with your time.
This is rank cowardice on your part, Ron. I've been trying to make the point that even if I wanted what you want for the world (not that you've ever truly articulated what the hell that is), it seems pretty damned certain that I would have no ability to truly understand as you would take every question as an attack, which you do now. It seems you want blind unquestioning sheep to follow you to your utopia, and that will never happen unless you're dealing with severely mentally impaired people (which you can find on the left with ease) and even then, some will ask "why?". Though I make no effort to hide the fact that I believe you are coming from a wacky fantasy land, my questions and objections are legitimate based on your less than detailed expressions of your hoped for nirvana, and not irrational attacks. That just makes you a paranoid goof rather than just a goof.
My original comment on this thread is testament to this problem. I merely pointed out that your example does not prove your point if there was no conviction of wrongdoing. In this country, one is innocent until proven guilty. But to you, mere accusation is sufficient to convict. And you make cracks about how terrible MY world is. By doing so, I didn't even state that I think your underlying fear of the gov't being cheated is wrong or right, but only that your example was a poor one because of that lack of conviction.
Try to have the courage of your convictions, Ron. If there's anything at all to your "reality", then to defend it against all comers should be child's play. I don't run from anyone on my blog.
BTW, regardless of whether or not you find the spine, my comments here serve as a counterpoint to your positions. Let others decide which of us makes more sense if you like.
If you have not seen this web site, you will find it interesting. http://opensourceecology.org/
The solar industry, like other industries is competing with China. Since China can make people work for little they have the labor cost advantage. We have to think about how our own behaviors effect industries and our environment. The only way we will have clean cheap energy is if we apply local solutions to the local problems, no company is going to so that for you and the current government is set up to keep the big energy providers with control.
"Doing business" with the Feds in EXPENSIVE ... the weight of the paperwork involved often exceeds the weight of the products delivered. My company REFUSES to bid Government Jobs for this reason ... too many hoops to jump through ... not worth the effort. So I guess Oracle must have added the "cost of doing business with Uncle Sam" to the price of their goods delievered ... makes sense to me.
Damn art you are so removed you have no clue what I am talking about.
I don't want anybody to follow me anywhere!!!!!!! Damn it why cant you get that!??
I'm just expressing myself Art. If if strikes a cord with you wonderful. If it doesn't, go look somewhere else for truth as you understand it.
I don't care if you think I live in a wacky fantasy land. Frankly lots of other people do to. So what is your point art? Why should I follow you or your reality. If others find your comments more relevant to their lives let them go there to.
I'm not in a competition here my friend. I'm not trying to convince anyone of anything. I am here for like minded people to grown in understanding. Since you are not one of them then understanding will never come. I know that so I recognize it as a waste of time to attempt that. Again, bless you and whatever is righteous for you. Go get'em, but it's not for me.
I tend to agree donkey. Its about people stepping up to take care of themselves as a community but without progressive thinkers in the community I am afraid we are doomed to the worn and well known comfort zone. The ever diminishing comfort zone. That is what makes change inevitable. There's no comfort in the old ways anymore. Its spent.
"Damn art you are so removed you have no clue what I am talking about."
Damn, Ron. You don't seem to get that I have always been admitting that I have no clue about what you're saying! I've been pleading for clarifications. My whole point of commenting has been to draw out some kind of articulation of what your ideas are. Instead, you view every little thing I say as an attack.
And how do you determine when a visitor is of like mind? By their simple agreement when you've said nothing? How does that work? Just an intuitive knowing that you and the visitor are simpatico? Well pardon me for not being thus in tune. I like to know without question what my like minded friends actually think so that I can determine if we really ARE like minded. How can I know if anything you say strikes a chord if it isn't well said enough to be understood?
Post a Comment